Browser choice in Linux Lite 2.2

[eightbit]

I read a lot about people not worrying too much about v2.2 moving to DVD sized media, however this is one of the things that I thought really made the distro stand out. The fact that so much functionality and style could still fit on a CD-R was just mindblowingly cool. Not to mention the fact that LL is gearing toward older hardware. I have a few machines that still have CD-R drives and not DVD drives. I have installed LL on friends old laptops with CD-Rom units. Some of these computers do not even have the ability to adjust the BIOS to boot from USB, so CD-Rom is the only choice.

For the web browser, absolutely a full fledged browser should be included with it. Chrome is the best choice not only for the netflix reason, but the fact that it integrates flash. With Firefox you need to have the Adobe Flash plugin (and old v11 at that) installed in order to play flash video. With Chrome it is built into the browser, and is a much newer version (v15) to boot. So, which is lighter? Chrome takes less to do more. Maybe removing Firefox and the flash plugin will free up some space

[gold_finger]

I read a lot about people not worrying too much about v2.2 moving to DVD sized media, however this is one of the things that I thought really made the distro stand out.

A lot of people, including myself, agree that this has been a big plus for LL over other distros.  I've recommended LL many times on other forums for that very reason.  However, over time:

• It gets increasingly difficult to keep the size under 700MB
  
• Less and less older hardware w/o DVD capabilities remain in active service, rendering need for CD size more unnecessary.
  
• To accomodate new hardware support, sometimes things are tweaked/removed from newer kernel versions and/or versions of Xorg (that are used by LL and other distros).  Unfortunately, that alone can break support for very old hardware, making CD-sized versions less and less useful for that purpose anyway.
  

Since LL 2.0 is supported until April, 2019 there will remain an option for those older computers for quite some time.  If I had to guess, I'd say by 2019 the vast majority of late 90's, early 2000's computers (which are ones most likely to not have DVD drives or USB boot capability) will be out of service anyway.

For the web browser, absolutely a full fledged browser should be included with it. Chrome is the best choice not only for the netflix reason, but the fact that it integrates flash.

This is potentially problematic.  While you and many others may feel that Chrome is the "best"; there are a number of people who would react to the inclusion of anything of Google's by default as highly offensive due to the extreme level of data mining and privacy intrusions their business model is based on.  I am one of them.  Even though I know that I could (and would) immediately delete and replace it, its presence alone on a standard install would be enough to make me reconsider using LL at all.  Because of how easy it is to install/remove whatever browser makes one happy, I see no reason to add a potentially highly controversial app that will instantly link negative feelings for Google with LL.  (When/If Misko's choose default browser application gets integrated into LL, switching browsers will be even easier than it already is.)

[eightbit]

This is potentially problematic.  While you and many others may feel that Chrome is the "best"; there are a number of people who would react to the inclusion of anything of Google's by default as highly offensive due to the extreme level of data mining and privacy intrusions their business model is based on.  I am one of them.  Even though I know that I could (and would) immediately delete and replace it, its presence alone on a standard install would be enough to make me reconsider using LL at all.  Because of how easy it is to install/remove whatever browser makes one happy, I see no reason to add a potentially highly controversial app that will instantly link negative feelings for Google with LL.  (When/If Misko's choose default browser application gets integrated into LL, switching browsers will be even easier than it already is.)

I see your point completely. Believe me, I have tried to avoid Google products like the plague for these reasons. I have migrated away from using Gmail as one example. As another I have tried to use DuckDuckGo for searches instead of Google. And, I have tried to use alternate browsers instead of Chrome. However some problems exist....

Google as a search engine is GOOD. I use it daily to gather system specs for customers for one. DuckDuckGo does a great job, but I have to move back to Google most of the time to find what I am really looking for. Chrome browser I can do without sometimes, but I need it for Netflix and more importantly I need it to view flash content that will not work in the current/last version in Linux from Adobe. I am finding more and more that content requires flash 12 or higher, and that is a big problem for Firefox in linux (and any other browser for that matter). If this keeps up (and I am sure it will), Chrome will be the only answer for viewing flash content. HTML5 is awesome and hopefully will remedy this entirely some day. But for now, new flash is needed and Chrome supplies it.

Bottom line is that sometimes you have to deal with certain things in order to have a useful experience. Most of us deal with non-free software out of convenience and usefulness because the computer is not very useful without much of it. I do not like the fact that Google tracks (although this can be shut off) but it is the only browser available to Linux currently that can do the aforementioned things. And since I want to do those things I have to use it. And because it can do things others cannot currently, it makes it the most useful browser currently available for Linux.

You should check this useful link which explains various portions of Chrome and how to turn it all off to enjoy the browser without the spying:

http://www.howtogeek.com/100361/how-to-o...m-privacy/

[Valtam]

I see the end choice for the default browser will be a difficult one, much like trying to drive a car with a cat on your arm...

[Alex]

[quote author=Alex link=topic=1099.msg6761#msg6761 date=1415298551]
I am quite happy with LL 2.0 will it still be supported or do we all have to change to 2.2? If we do have to change can it be done through the "install updates" option? If not, does it mean we have to do a complete re-install and so somehow copy our home folder onto a flash drive?

Thanks

alex

Don't sweat it Alex. Just keep running LL2.0 and keep updating and upgrading. No need to sweat LL2.2 at all.
You are not missing anything. Just my opinion.
[/quote]

Sounds good to me TY

[Teddy]

The Firefox browser does a good job on keeping Linux Lite, light. Google Chrome is just a memory hog by comparison and would strangle the hell out of older machines. It wouldn't be a bad idea to offer a little LL "tweak" program that allows users to download Google Chrome or Midori through a simply coded program that sends the wget command to retrieve the Google Chrome .deb package and install it, similar to how Zorin OS let's you choose Google Chrome or Opera to download and install for you. Just a little idea.

[rokytnji]

I just installed opera-developer_27.0.1670.0_amd64.deb

After adding my preferred extentions/addons plus

In contrast to many other plugins ZenMate also fully encrypts all your browser traffic.

Other plugins just work like a proxy that change your IP but do not offer encryption. ZenMate is the first plugin to offer real security and privacy by encrypting everything you do in your browser so that hackers and sniffing spooks (such as ISPs and governments) don't have a chance to get hold of you.

and only running it for a couple of hours. I watched Radioactive Wolves Of Chernobyl - Scary Mutations [Full Documentary] with it.

I can say it is faster than FireFox or Chromium on my Laptop so fart. It has been pretty snappy. I can't vouch for stability or ease of use yet.
2 hours is no real test yet. Plus. I am posting with it right now. No lags like I get on Firefox on certain sites like one of the forums I moderate at.

[Coastie]

... there are a number of people who would react to the inclusion of anything of Google's by default as highly offensive due to the extreme level of data mining and privacy intrusions their business model is based on.  I am one of them.  Even though I know that I could (and would) immediately delete and replace it, ...

I would not find Chrome as the default browser offensive but I too would remove it immediately due to privacy concerns and replace it with Firefox.

[eightbit]

[quote author=gold_finger link=topic=1099.msg6766#msg6766 date=1415306359]
... there are a number of people who would react to the inclusion of anything of Google's by default as highly offensive due to the extreme level of data mining and privacy intrusions their business model is based on.  I am one of them.  Even though I know that I could (and would) immediately delete and replace it, ...

I would not find Chrome as the default browser offensive but I too would remove it immediately due to privacy concerns and replace it with Firefox.
[/quote]

The funny thing is that by default Firefox is set to track *as well*. You have to turn it off in your settings (the same as Chrome):

https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/dnt/

Interesting that I just visited this link with the default included Firefox in LL 2.0, and "Do Not Track" is set to OFF by default.


My point is that if the only point people have in not using Chrome over Firefox is because it "tracks", that point is moot. BOTH browsers are by default set to track you and that setting can be disabled in BOTH. Actually, Chrome has even deeper settings to disable a plethora of things that can bug you (see the link I posted previously). Memory usage as far as I have seen is on par. With a few tabs open now, Firefox is consuming 180MB. Chrome with the same tabs open is consuming 190MB. Results vary, but I have not found any memory usage to be an issue with either browser even on low memory machines.

The only thing I can see for not wanting Chrome is because it is currently popular to "hate" Google. I personally do not care whom delivers the goods...as long as they work good I love firefox, do not get me wrong. I have been using it since it was "Firebird", and Seamonkey, etc. They are just now lacking features nowadays.

The way I understand it, LL is supposed to be here to be fast, light and an easy transition for newcomers migrating from Windows platforms. How is it when that newcomer opens Firefox and cannot view modern flash content because the default Linux flash plugin is no longer supported by Adobe and will never get another update beyond the now extremely outdated v11? Or the Windows user who opens Firefox and navigates to Netflix just to find that streaming their Walking Dead episodes does not work because they are running an "unsupported web browser". I can tell you for sure that anyone I would introduce it to in its default state would not go for it. It is not until I add Chrome that it is ok by their standards. Chrome fixes these problems for a new user. As much as people do not like that reality, it is a fact.

If it were different and Firefox could handle these modern technologies in Linux (be it if they decided to support them, or they decided to support Firefox) I would be all for it of course. But it cannot...so I cannot.

I have seen firsthand over the years what lack of browser support has done to OS's and devices. My beloved BeOS suffered from lack of browser support with up to date technologies. My Playbook suffered a terrible fate largely because people wanted to stream Netflix on tablets and it was unsupported (although I am not calling it the only reason, but rest assured it was a big one). The internet is the biggest item used in todays modern computing, and the browser is the tool to get you there. If it lacks technologies, the experience is hindered. And nobody likes that

[bitsnpcs]

The only thing I can see for not wanting Chrome is because it is currently popular to "hate" Google. I personally do not care whom delivers the goods...as long as they work good I love firefox, do not get me wrong. I have been using it since it was "Firebird", and Seamonkey, etc. They are just now lacking features nowadays.

Hello eightbit,
I looked at Chrome a while back (on a windows computer) and Google wanted me to install its social media and set up an account on its email platform, I decided not to install Google Chrome.